QoD: “Tell me again the net good these people serve?” edition


[Y]our hands should be visible on the steering wheel and you should not be moving at all. Don’t try to get your wallet out or reach into your glove compartment for your insurance card. Remain perfectly still! Listen to what the officer tells you to do and obey his commands. If there is any doubt at all what the cop wants you to do, simply freeze. Don’t move at all until you are sure what the cop wants you to do. Always err on the side of remaining motionless rather than doing something when there is any doubt about the cop’s commands.

When the force that’s supposed to moderate danger becomes the greater danger, has it not obviated its reason to exist?

It’s time for people to stop outsourcing their own protection.

h/t

About Joel

You shouldn't ask these questions of a paranoid recluse, you know.
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16 Responses to QoD: “Tell me again the net good these people serve?” edition

  1. I’ve long told my adult kids that “officer friendly isn’t so friendly anymore.” My own experiences with being pulled over have not been pleasant ones.

  2. billf says:

    Sorry,I usually agree with you,but when interacting with a cop, and you make a move which could be interpreted as drawing a gun,what would you expect his reaction to be?

  3. Joel says:

    Billf you can’t possibly be suggesting that a police officer’s proper action is to shoot every person he encounters who makes a move which could be interpreted as drawing a gun.

  4. Unclezip says:

    The Baroness got stopped- wrongly – a few months ago, and while she was schooling the young deputy, she was dropping cigarette ashes out the window onto his shoes. I believe he got the message.

  5. Cops should all just drop dead. Seriously. I’m not joking even a little.

  6. Kentucky says:

    ” . . . you can’t possibly be suggesting that a police officer’s proper action is to shoot every person he encounters who makes a move which could be interpreted as drawing a gun.”

    No, but what would you have the cop do . . . wait until the “subject” has drawn his gun and fired the first shot?? The whole thing transpires in fractions of a second, Joel. The cop at least has to begin his draw at the first notion that the “subject” is going for a gun. One hopes the cop has had adequate training that will allow him to delay his own trigger squeeze until he positively identifies the weapon (in the dark, in the rain, etc), but that’s splitting the hair even finer. You could not pay me enough to be a cop.

  7. billf says:

    Yes,sorry joel,that’s what I’m suggesting.If I was a cop I would be completely fair,but if you draw on me ,I’ll shoot you.

  8. Joel says:

    But you just changed the rules. If I draw on you, nobody could possibly fault you for defending yourself. “Makes a move which could be interpreted as drawing a gun” includes going for my driver’s license, or answering my phone, or scratching my ribs – actions for which I wish I could expect a highly trained peace officer to not shoot me.

  9. larryarnold says:

    actions for which I wish I could expect a highly trained peace officer to not shoot me.

    And if the cop you run into is, he probably won’t. But all the others…

    OTOH, to even things out, I’m not going to make what could be threatening moves around anyone, given 15,000,000 licensees out there, as well as assorted illegally-armed folks.

  10. Mike says:

    I have a hard time imagining any situation that gets better when a cop is involved. Best advice is avoid all interaction with them. The last two or three times I’ve been stopped involved a burned license plate light, an “improperly” adjusted convex mirror on the rear corner of a company box van, and a left turn late at night where the rear wheels crossed the yellow lines. My comment to “you know why I pulled you over?” Is always, “No offense but I don’t talk to cops. If you want my paperwork I’ve got it so long as you don’t shoot me when I reach for it.” They act a little flustered but I don’t care.

  11. MamaLiberty says:

    Could someone please tell me what there is about a “license plate light” or a mirror placement, or any of the hundreds of other minimal things cops “pull over” people for… that is so damned important it is worth someone’s life? Anyone’s life?

    And then there is the little matter of cops giving hysterical and contradicting “orders” to those they stop. “DON’T MOVE” and “OPEN THE F>>> Window” are mutually exclusive commands… and, I assume, that calmly asking him/her to “make up your mind” would not help any.

  12. Kentucky says:

    “Makes a move which could be interpreted as drawing a gun”

    That right there is the crux of the matter. Comes right down to what the cop sees and how the situation has developed so far and how much situational training the cop has had and how bad his morning has been, etc, etc.

    The lengthy article linked above pretty much covers all that, and doesn’t give the cop a “get out of jail free” card, but neither does it relieve the civilian’s responsibility for common sense reaction to a cop given the times we live in, like them or not. It’s good if EVERYBODY goes home safe at the end of the day.

    All that said, “Best advice is avoid all interaction with them” if at all possible.

  13. Cops are dangerous animals. Last I got pulled over, I had merged onto the freeway 20 mph over the posted limit in the middle of a far left city. The cop had me do a roadside sobriety test (had not been drinking). When I got out of the car, showed him my carry license with hands visible. He un-holstered and unloaded my primary for “officer safety”. Did not feel the need to disclose that I carry a backup. Playing along with the dominance game resulted in just a warning. I think it helped that I gave polite non-answers to his questions so he had less to work with.

    The point is that one has to keep in mind that legally protected violent sociopaths are dangerous, so act accordingly.

  14. None says:

    Could someone please tell me what there is about a “license plate light” or a mirror placement, or any of the hundreds of other minimal things cops “pull over” people for… that is so damned important it is worth someone’s life?

    Following the link Joel provided takes you to Ellifritz’ post on the subject; cops are trolling for open warrants and suspended licenses with these very minor traffic offenses and equipment problems. Get lucky, and you get a gold star for a felony warrant bust; worst case, you still get to hassle someone with a citation, and just maybe, there’s something in the car that can be used for an arrest, because it’s arrests that earn extra points.

    Like the woman in Omaha last week whose car door blew shut in the wind with her niece and the keys inside. When she couldn’t get in, she called 911 for help. She got help, all right: the cops smashed the window, extricated the child and charged Mom with child abuse by neglect.

    Lessons learned: 1) always have a spare key on your person; 2) breaking your own window to get in will cost the same as if a cop did it for you, but you won’t need a lawyer afterward; 3) Auto locksmiths dispatched by AAA don’t have arrest powers.

  15. MamaLiberty says:

    Of course, None… I understand all of that perfectly well. I should have been clearer… my point is the question of why any cop would risk his/her life for such trivia. They’ll probably face more and more danger in “routine traffic stops” as the current insanity unfolds. At some point, none of those things will be worth the risk. When people are pushed to the point where they have little or nothing to lose…

  16. Waepnedmann says:

    Irish proverb:

    “There is no human condition so terrible that the arrival of a police officer cannnot make it worse.”

    It depends on the cop.

    From my observations and experiences 95% of people who want to be cops should be rejected out of hand just for the reason that they want to be cops. It is like Tam’s politician disqualifier: anyone who wants to be a politician indicates an unsuitabliy for office just because they have the desire to be a politician. These people have a mental defect.
    I once worked with a sworn officer who got hired even though he failed the psyche eval (small county, friend of a friend of the department head). He was different, but I did not observe anything alarming. Although, he did have a Monster Hunter Nation tattoo on his right calf. I liked working with him and while he was different, he was not evil.
    I also worked with a violent, pathological lying, racist SOB that I triggered a criminal nvestigation on that got swept under the rug (he was a member of management’s inner circle) He had passed the psyche eval.
    So much for the Minnesota Multiphasic Peronality Index.

To the stake with the heretic!